In Germany, we actually have the fall meeting of our bishops in Fulda whose majority looks for a shism by denying everything our former popes did teach. They want the end of celibacy, women priests, free divorce, free homosexuality and so on.
My hero is Rainer Maria Cardinal Woelki, Archbishop of (2000 year old, roman foundet) Cologne, at river Rhine who is fighting for our values. ...

I've read about this. Pope Francis needs to take strong, bold action (the strongest canonical penalties seem to apply). I doubt he will, but pray for you and the Church.

The worst outcome would be to compromise or leave it in some sort of limbo. That would be a cancer on the entire Church worldwide.


To be honest, things will be havier. The Pope wants the same as the Germans want, but the way of our bishop means shism because they want to have it all and they want it now.

Therefore, the Pope lets Tornielli declare, that viri probati will come, but for the entire world. Our brothers in the orthodox church will legitimate it because they have it all the time.

The calculation is that conservatives will not leave the church because of this. If they do, they are shismatics...

@Pantheon @George Peter, what do you actually think about what is going on with your Bishops? We hear snippets from Catholic news sources here but, what is the general feeling of the average Catholic in Germany right now?

@chrisdash @George

Hello Chris, sorry for the late answer. Germany is a post-christian country and the rest is under a giant media pressure to bring the church under political control. Some german bishops are actually doing that from within ("Synodal Path"). Our church shall merge with the protestant to a kind of "german-national-church".

The best is to read what Maike Hickson (a native German) writes on lifesitenews. She's very good connected and knows a lot. Everything is true!

@Pantheon @George I just wonder what the impact will be to the Church as a whole with the Amazon and German synods. I know that a synod is supposed to be non-binding and local but, it seems like the process is being used as an attempt to force modernism on the whole Church.

Then the question becomes is it schism, is it something the larger Church even considers, what is the response?

@chrisdash @George

I think the Germans (esp. Card. Kasper, Marx and Overbeck) want to make the path for the whole church. After amoris laetetia the amazon synod shall open the window for viri probati, the other items (LGBT ...) will be quoted, but not more.

The german "Synodal Path" will need about two years and open the window for the other items. A merger with the protestant church may be - PF knows that - the most dangerous point with regard to shism. The Germans are really determined.

@Pantheon @George I worry that as the Amazon and German "Synodal Paths" move forward the US might try the same thing. Hopefully not but, the media will spin this as "The Church" deciding to make x or y OK but, only in certain places.

That isn't the case, of course.

@chrisdash @George

Exactly, the German way shall lead the pope to further and radical changes. These bishops are still too arrogant to let the pope lead the process.

To be honest: it is this attitude which makes me hopeful! In every revolution, the most active leaders go their own way, create their own sub groups and have more disagreement. It makes them weak! Let's pray for their disagreement on that way. It will prevent the schism.

@chrisdash @George

Over the last days I was in the Croation town Dubrovnik, really medieval, in a real catholic country.

Nice days with nice right and clear thinking people.

I'll hope this will last, despite of the western ideological media pressure.

The people there know about "Home". They fought a Homeland War, some - not even - 30 years ago!

Tell me, why there are so many (US-) tourists in that town, created only by those old and ridicolous beliefs?

Sign in to participate in the conversation — a friendly social networking space for those with an interest in Catholicism.